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Some other questions, is quota system indefinite... next what reservations on religion basis, is capping of quotas needed, will it divide the country in the long run,
 
Leaving aside political agendas, the whole issue could be summarised as trying to find a balance between meritocracy and fair representation/equal opporunities for dalits/OBCs. Either case, India has to benefit, or it may be a case of all becoming poor, equally.  
 
 
SUNDAY DEBATE: Should IIT/IIM quotas be increased to 49.5%? Yes
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1473380.cms
 
D Shyam Babu, Fellow, Rajiv Gandhi Institute for Contemporary Studies

The Centre's move to increase the number of students from the weaker sections in IITs and IIMs to the tune of 49.5% has not come a day too soon.

Even conceding that quota system is not the best way of promoting social justice, one should support it as a remedial measure since everything else has failed in India: Society failed to live by the tenets of civic engagement and a sense of justice, and the state failed to impose even the ideals it stands by. How else can one explain the complete absence of weaker sections in elite institutions?

Are the SCs, STs and OBCs inherently so incompetent and lazy that even a few of them fail to make it to the top? It is true that they are not prevented from entering these institutions because of their social status.

But the discrimination they suffer is more structural in that they live typically in villages, with few avenues of economic mobility and the little education they manage to provide to their children being far below the 'standards' set by elite institutions.

Their qualifications are suspect and they cannot compete with urban educated students in the entrance exams. One specific handicap that these students from the weaker sections face is not being proficient in English.

"Give them quality education" is the usual answer by those who resent quotas but at the same time they are aware that quality education is a distant dream.

The entry of weaker sections in large numbers into elite institutes may initially cause some culture shock, but ultimately it will promote common good.

In a way, quotas are a kind of poetic justice because they remind us of our collective guilt of acquiescing in a social setup that plays havoc with millions of people. In fact, why favour the so-called weaker sections alone?

All of rural India is discriminated against by default. Even a middle class 'upper' caste household in rural area can not give its children the kind of education that prepares them for IITs and IIMs. By accounting for just 30% of the population, urban India cannot claim the whole cake.
 
The argument that merit, not caste, should be the criterion for admissions gains credence only if it has some consistency. Where has it been established that only the Vaishnava Brahmin Community (VBC) is competent to make laddus at Sri Tirumala Temple in Tirupati?

But the vocation is 'reserved' for that community. When we think of laddus, we think of Agarwal Sweets or Haldiram, certainly not VBC.

In an open competition, some Chinese company could have outbid everybody, including VBC, and supplied tasty laddus at unbeatable price.
 
 
SUNDAY DEBATE: Should IIT/IIM quotas be increased to 49.5%? No
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1473378.cms
 
P V Indiresan, Former director, IIT Madras

The move by the group of ministers to impose 49.5% reservation in IITs and IIMs is sad news as much for the backward castes as it is for the institutions concerned.

For decades, reservation has been used as a substitute for genuine development. With this new move, politicians will have one more excuse to neglect the welfare of the communities they claim to support.

If reservation had been the antidote for backwardness, after 50 years or more of its use, it should have become unnecessary. The fact that people want even more of it means that reservation is not a remedy, but an addiction.

Ideally, the solution is to provide good instruction for all from the pre-primary stage itself. If that is deemed impractical, at least after the primary stage, a couple of hundred poor, backward caste children per district should get vouchers to enable them to study in top schools.

Those additional years of good education will empower them to stand on their own feet, to gain admission in prestigious institutions with dignity and not by force.
 
 
What the group of ministers has decreed is that no institution should be caste-free, that the meritorious cannot have any rights whatever and they cannot have any place of their own under the Indian sun.

This move turns the idea of morality upside down: Poor children of forward castes are deemed punishable for no reason other than their parentage; rich backward caste children are deemed worthy of patronage for no reason other than that they enjoy overwhelming power.

Those who breathe casteism declare themselves to be secular; those who plead for quality education are condemned as communal. It is indeed a repetition of the story of the wolf and the lamb.

IITs and IIMs that have been free of communal canker all their lives will now become breeding ground for the worst form of casteism.

Just at the time the country is about to take off economically, and take its due place in the world, this move will destroy the institutions that have contributed most for that progress. Their demise is not the true tragedy; that the nation should be forced to kill the goose that lays golden eggs is the real tragedy.

Words will not defeat this blatant misuse of power; action is needed. Right-thinking persons should demonstrate that a good school education for the deprived, and not reservation, is the real remedy. I will give half my pension to do so. I call on others to contribute what they can.
 
Reservation will affect bright students: Alva
http://www.newkerala.com/news2.php?action=fullnews&id=39345
Kolkata: Congress general secretary Margaret Alva today admitted that reservation in central educational institutions would affect bright students but the measure was taken to give "equal" opportunity to students from backward classes.
"It is true that a section of bright students will be affected because the number of general seats will come down. But we are talking of equal opportunities and students from the backward classes seldom have the opportunity to go to good institutions," she told reporters here.
She said that the proposal to reserve 27 per cent of seats in central universities and institutions should not be a problem since the Supreme Court has set a 50 per cent limit on seat reservation in the academic institutions.
The proposal also had the nod of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, she said.
HRD Minister Arjun Singh had said yesterday that it was the government's responsibility to implement the law in this regard and felt opposition to it was being whipped up.
Singh also accused 'some people' of trying to whip up the issue.
 
'Reservations V/s Merit: A Distressing Development'   
NEW DELHI, APRIL 7 (PTI)
http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_news.asp?gid=90&id=376377
 
The government's plan to introduce 27 percent reservation in central educational institutions and IIMs and IITs today evoked mixed reaction from academics and political parties with strong views for and against.
 
Pratap Bhanu Mehta, member-convenor of National Knowledge Commission, has termed as a "distressing development" the move for reservation and sent an e-mail to all Commission members urging them to write to the Prime Minister seeking his intervention in the matter.
 
"These is no point having the Commission if we don't take a stand on this issue," Mehta said.
Another member of the Commission Jayati Ghosh, who is a professor at the Centre for Economic Studies and Planning, JNU, said the HRD Minister's decision on quotas was "badly timed and not a good decision".
Taking a slightly different stand, Vice Chairman of the Commission said while not much has been done to provide equal opportunities since independence, reservations could be provided for a period (may be another ten years) but the quota system cannot continue indefinitely.
 
He said "the question is what is the intention of the government. If the intention is to perpetuate reservations, which means not giving equal opportunity to everyone forever,
I am against the entire set of policies that would direct us not to give equal opportunities to everybody." N S Ramaswamy, former Professor and a founder Director of Indian Institute of Management, Bangalore, favours the move by the HRD Ministry to provide for quota in central universities, IIMs and IITs, saying it is a "desirable thing".

M Ananda Krishnan, Chairman of the Madras Institute of Developmental Studies (MIDS), said it is a constitutional requirement and has to be implemented and "there is no question in asking whether it is right or wrong". Caste-based party Pattali Makkal Katchih (PMK) founder-leader S Ramadoss in Tamil Nadu welcomed reservation saying it would create a 'revolution' in the field of higher education.
General Secretary of Dravidar Kazhagam (DK) Kali Poonkundran said it was a 'welcome measure'.
 
However, V S Chandralekha, Janata Party leader in Tamil Nadu, opposed reservations in centres of excellence as the communities for whom the measure is aimed at has enough members who would qualify for admission even without quota.
Well known journalist 'Cho' S Ramaswamy, said bringing in a legislation for reservation in IIMs and IITs was "legally tenable but morally wrong" because the "Centre is bringing it with an eye on elections and it will give unfair advantage to the ruling outfits at the Centre and not to ruling parties in the states.
 
'Cho' said he was against increasing quota in any sector and steps should be taken to gradually reduce reservation and not increase it in an age of competition. "Merit must be given primacy", he said.
 
However, according to Ramaswamy, "we cannot have a uniform policy in an unequal situation since it will increase the inequity.
 
He said the government is controlling only ten percent of the total seats in engineering, medical and management institutions and the rest remained in the hands of private sector which could cater to upper segments of society.
 
The most clear-headed criticism of the move has come from Pratap Bhanu Mehta, who, in his reported e-mail to the other members of the National Knowledge Commission has said that “IITs are already facing severe faculty shortages, and to simply increase the number of seats will have serious adverse consequences. It shows the extent to which these institutions are being subjected to the ministry’s own political and intellectual predilections".
Mehta argues that "there is probably more a consensus on SC/ST reservation, but reservations for OBCs have very little justification: indeed it is in some ways hurting the cause of SC/STs. But the idea that 49 pc of seats must come under reserved categories is surely alarming."
 
Meht a has basically summed up the arguments against the new proposals on three grounds: "First, the new proposals are incompatible with promoting excellence and autonomy. Second, the access to education should be distributed widely across social groups, but 49 pc reserved seats is a step in the wrong direction. At the moment, measures are in place for SCs/STs and these should not be supplemented by reservation for OBCs. This is an opportunity to think afresh on this issue and not rush into introducing measures that we know are irreversible

Reservation in IITs, IIMs opposed
http://www.newkerala.com/news2.php?action=fullnews&id=39312
Chennai: Janata Party today opposed the UPA government's proposed move to introduce reservation in top educational institutions like Indian Institute of Management and Indian Institute of Technology.
In a statement here, party President Dr Subramanian Swamy, said "the intention behind the decision becomes clear when we realise that the reservation order will not apply to minority run institutions.Nor will it bar minorities from being included in the backward class quotas applicable in non-minority run educational establishments." Backward class students "cannot be uplifted by quotas, but by providing scholarships and free tuition.

 
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1669558,0002.htm?
headline=Reservation~will~divide~country:~Ratan~Tata

In a scathing attack on the move to introduce reservation for other
backward castes in higher education institutes funded by the central
Government, Tata Sons Chairman Ratan N Tata warned that such a
policy would "divide" the nation.
Addressing a press conference on the occasion of Convocation 2006,
at IMT Ghaziabad, he said, "Though I do not want to comment,
reservation is bad... In some way, it will tend to divide the
country into different groups."
Ratan Tata asserted that efforts should be made to encourage people
to stay unified. He expressed displeasure over the reservations,
calling it a "bad" move.

Union Minister for Commerce and Industries and Ratan N Tata,
Chairman, Tata Sons at the convocation ceremony of the B-school in
Ghaziabad on Friday.
On reports of Government gearing up for introducing job reservation
in private sector, he said, "I do not think this is a right way to
go forward. Sadly, such policies would not help in the development
of the nation."
While the upliftment of the socially backward classes was important,
merit should be the only criteria and there should be no compromise
on this issue, he added.
He urged the students to make their mark in various fields by
upholding the principles and values, thus combining their vision
with passion.
Union Minister for Commerce and Industries, Kamal Nath, who is also
the president of the institute, encouraged the students to play a
pivotal role and face the challenges in moulding the destiny of the
nation.
He referred to the fast pace of economic growth in India led by the
metaphoric shifting of trade winds which had moved the hub of
economic activity from the Atlantic to the Indian ocean.

http://www.hvk.org/articles/0597/0201.html
Title : Folly of reservations
Author : C. P. Bhambhri
Publication : The Hindustan Times
Date : May 23, 1997
The Constitution (Amendment) Bill which provides for 33 per cent of
reserved seats for women in the Legislatures has not been openly
opposed by any political party or group because everyone wants to
be branded as progressive by empowering the effectively
disenfranchised women of India. The only opposition to the Bill
has come from caste and community leaders who by joining the
bandwagon of reservations want that such reservations should be on
the basis of caste and religion of the women. Thus, these leaders
want the casteisation and communalisation of the Legislatures.

If one follows the yardsticks of the political class of the 1990s,
the makers of the Indian Constitution would be dubbed as social
reactionaries because they showed great caution in dealing with the
whole social project of affirmative action for safeguarding the
rights and interests of sections who were inheritors of
historically determined social discriminations. It is essential to
mention that the Constitution tried to reconcile many
irreconcilables by adopting a balanced middle path while dealing
with the complex and contradictory social realities.

If, on one hand, a bold experiment was launched by adopting the
principle of universal adult franchise, on the other, reservation
of seats in Legislatures was provided for the Scheduled Castes and
Scheduled Tribes. It was a powerful intervention by the
Constitution to empower the most underprivileged and discriminated
sections of Indian society. The authors of the Constitution did
not go berserk on the policy of reservation of seats in
Legislatures because they clearly rejected the demand for communal
representation. Not only this. The reservation of seats for the
Scheduled Castes, Tribes and for Anglo-Indians was only for a
temporary period and it was to be reviewed after ten years of the
commencement of the Constitution.

By various amendments of the Constitution, especially the
Constitution (Forty-fifth Amendment) Act of 1980 and the
Constitution (Sixty-second Amendment) Act of 1989, it is proposed
to extend it up to 2000 AD only. This cautious attitude of the
Founders of the Indian Republic is also clearly reflected in
adopting a policy of reservation of seats in public services for
the deprived strata of society. If, on one hand, every citizen was
guaranteed equality of opportunity, on the other, reservation of
seats for the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes was provided to
take care of the inherited social disabilities of sections of
society who were to be protected against the unregulated principle
of abstract equality.

Further, even these reservations in public services were to be
consistent with "the maintenance of efficiency of administration."
Many a time, the Supreme Court has applied correctives in reminding
the policy makers about the limits of the policy of reservations in
public services. The Supreme Court in 1951 in the Venkataramana V.
State of Madras case held that a person could not be kept out of
public services because he was a Brahmin or again in the Balaji V.
State of Mysore case in 1963, observed that reservations made
"under Article 16(4) beyond the permissible and legitimate limits
would be liable to be challenged as a fraud on the Constitution."

When Mr V. P. Singh, a self-appointed messiah of social justice,
found the recommendations made by Mandal Commission on reservations
as a profitable political commodity, he created a stir by suddenly
announcing the acceptance of the Mandal report on August 7, 1990.
This raw politics of reservations was played by Mr V. P. Singh and
others without any holds barred and the Supreme Court again
intervened to tell the adventurist political class that
reservations in services cannot go beyond 50 per cent and that the
policy of reservations in public services shall exclude the "creamy
layers" of the reserved social categories.

By abandoning the note of caution administered by the Constitution,
the new messiahs of reservations in Legislatures and public
services have completely fragmented and factionalised the already
divided society. Politics is not just a mirror reflection of
social reality. It is equally concerned with changing the
inherited social categories and identities. The political class by
following a reckless policy of reservations has encouraged social
antagonisms based on caste versus caste, sub-caste versus sub-caste
and now it is wanting to bring this division among the women in
India.

India has inherited a very complex caste system, but the policy of
reservations has solidified 04 institutionalised caste divisions
and caste identities. Politics of reservations generates and
stimulates caste, community and gender consciousness and every
group in India is involved in targeting the other group as villain
of the piece. Social deprivations are not attributed to the
Himalayan failures of the economic path of development followed by
the country. The political class does not want to become a target
of the deprived people and by following a policy of reservations,
politicians have successfully created a situation where different
social groups are targeting each other for their deprivations.

The journey of casteism began with Forward Castes versus Backward
Castes and it has reached a stage where every sub-caste is against
every other sub-caste. Tamil Nadu has witnessed violence by
backward castes against the Scheduled Castes and the rural
population of Uttar Pradesh and Bihar is actually involved in a
violent caste war. Has the policy of reservations brought social
justice for the really deprived groups in society? The answer to
this question is a Big No.

If the unending system of reservations has promoted serious social
cleavages, it has also displaced from public controversy the
serious agenda of economic growth with justice. While Mr Mulayam
Singh Yadav, Mr Laloo Prasad Yadav, Mr Kanshi Ram, Miss Mayawati
and future women representatives in the State Legislatures have
created assured social and sectarian constituencies for winning an
election, they have completely failed to evolve socio-economic
programmes for the real empowerment of the Dalits. Mr Laloo Prasad
Yadav is electorally invincible because of the electoral support of
Muslims and Yadavs of Bihar, but the landless agricultural workers
of Bihar have to migrate in distress to search for their livelihood
to Haryana and Punjab. All political factions which are
masquerading as champions of the Dalits have not undertaken a
single real step which can empower people living below the poverty
line.

The Constitution favoured limited reservations because it was
believed that gradually the need for reservations will not be felt
because the successful implementation of the programmes of
socio-economic development will create new opportunities for the
development of the whole of India. Not only has India badly messed
up its developmental agenda, the self-appointed guardians of caste,
community and gender reservations do not have any agenda for the
social and economic development of the country. Mr Laloo Prasad
Yadav, Mr Mulayam Singh Yadav, Mr Kanshi Ram, Miss Mayawati, who
are the product of casteisation of Indian politics, have failed to
pull out their states from the existing stage of poverty and
underdevelopment.

The politics of Forward Caste versus Backward Caste, or Hindu
versus Muslim or Male versus Female has succeeded not only in
dividing the society, it has legitimised the idea of politics for
the sake of power alone. The believers in the policy of
reservations have reduced social justice to a meaningless slogan.
The unfinished task of land reforms has not been implemented by the
practitioners of social justice and the landless agricultural
workers have not escaped from the continuing tyrannies of the
landowning castes.

Every political party has become a victim of the aimless politics
of reservations. The Communist Parties resisted and very
reluctantly fell in line with Mr V. P. Singh's politics of Mandal.
'Re BJP's Hindutva has no answer to the politics of caste versus
caste among the so-called Hindus whom the BJP claims to represent.
The growing decline and decay of the Congress can be attributed to
its failure to respond to sectarian politics of the votaries of
reservations. Fragmented society has also fragmented politics.
Since the 1990s the Central Government has become weak, unstable
and vulnerable to domestic and foreign pressures because the
electoral verdict is fragmented.

The upshot is that the policies of reservations are mere rhetoric
because the real flesh and blood of empowerment and social justice
is conspicuous by its absence in the agenda of the champions of
reservations. This policy is socially disastrous because it has
generated the feelings of social distancing. The political parties
which emerged as champions of reservations have failed to provide
stable governments because the electoral verdict has been
fragmented as a result of sectional reservations. There is no
evidence that political empowerment of Dalits has brought any
change in the life of the Dalits. Similarly, political empowerment
of women will not bring any benefit to the landless agricultural
women of India.

 

India Together: Do reservations work? - 15 April 2005
www.indiatogether.org/2005/apr/soc-rsvstudy.htm - 28k - 6 Apr 2006

Dalits in Society : India Together
Reservation will divide country: Ratan Tata
Sanjay Kumar (HindustanTimes.com)
Ghaziabad, April 7, 2006

 
Others insightful articles
 
India Together: Do reservations work? - 15 April 2005
www.indiatogether.org/2005/apr/soc-rsvstudy.htm - 28k - 6 Apr 2006

Dalits in Society : India Together
www.indiatogether.org/society/caste.htm
 
This is a good one.
Affirmative action for a shared India
www.himalmag.com/2006/march/analysis_5.html
Thinking Together
pd.cpim.org/2003/0810/08102003_thinking.htm

India's lower castes can now go to private schools | csmonitor.com
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0213/p04s01-wosc.html
Has Job Reservation Been Effective? Caste, Religion, and Economic ...
www.econ.cam.ac.uk/faculty/iyer/JobReservationIndia.pdf
Infosys mentor against
www.rediff.com/news/2003/apr/15murthy.htm

No